I got a ticket for a noise violation tonight. The officer said my exhaust was too loud because he could hear me with his windows up and he was in the opposing lane. Its a $1062.00 ticket. I really dont think that is remotely fair. I live in Lexington, South carolina home of the loud redneck trucks, and I dont get whats the difference between a loud truck and a loud car. There not getting pulled over.
If you modified your exhaust or have an exhaust leak that you didn't fix then you're tempting fate. Trucks get the ticket too but a cop is less forgiving to someone with a 4 cyl sedan making noise than a large displacement truck. A car almost has to try to be loud comparatively.
Prove to the judge that your car is quieter than a stock harley davidson ;) As long as the exhaust was intact for the laws in your state, you might be able to get away with it
I had the same thing happen to me and I beat the ticket. My exhaust system was 100% legal and without modifications. The cop had a "hard-on" for an import. The cop has NO RIGHT to decide what kind of muffler you run. Go to court and argue that your car is not excessively loud and you installed a stainless steel muffler because they last longer. Also, go by a muffler shop and get a certification certificate that you're legal. It will get dismissed.
Thanks for the advice. I think we ran into the same "hard-on" Cop. This is the same cop that pulled me for my underglo.
it's true though... Alot of them will chase the tuners... Hell, I've driven through ride checks in my Crown vic, Windows so dark you can't see in with the pipes broken off after the cats... They don't even look at me lol... I used to drive an '83 buick skyhawk, and we were messing around in a parking lot one night... so when we leave, my one buddy, who drives a dodge ram, was the only one to leave like a human being (For once...) and he was the only one who got pulled over... later the cop asked "Hey is that guy with you?" to which my buddy replies yes... and the cop looked back and said "Wow, I thought that was an old man!" Moral of the story, Driving old man cars pays off ;)
im suprisingly gonna agree with logan here... I too have had a sound violation ticket... I have a older magnaflow setup on my car and it is completley legal... I had the car inspected at the shop the next day and from there i took it to court... The judge looked at the ticket interviewed the cop... looked at the certificate from the shop and then dismissed the ticket... The cop then out of pure spite pulled me over for stunting as i was leaving the courthall parking lot... i didnt do anything and he did it right in front of the judge... who again interviewed the cop and gave him stern warning to practice law in areas where law is needed to be practiced... ill never forget that because the cop really needed to be reigned in... as for the underglow neon yeah thats a tough one to get away from... i mean ur not really gonna hide it from them eh haha... $1062 thats one steep ticket... he must really have needed to fill a quota or something... anyways good luck... definetally get it certified ASAP so that the times from the ticket to the inspection is as minimal as possible...
The brilliance to underglow, is you can put it on a switch to turn it off... Use it responsibly and they won't nail you...
its more of a import thing i dont really like them but i suppose theres a market for it ... and yeah a switch would be good.... but really the guys using the rope xmas lights... thats kinda lazy even if it does work pretty well... teehee...
yea you can beat the ticket there is always a loop hole for everything and at least you didnt get a ticket in cali for driving under the influence those can be up to $12,000
Neons....well, that is a whole different bucket of worms. The cops have written all kinds of "LOCAL ORDINANCES" they use as a "catch all!" Their normal response is "IMPERSONATION OF AN EMERGENCY/POLICE VEHICLE." Yeah...I know. But, they do that based upon the color of the lights. If they are red or appears to be blue, they can totally GET AWAY WITH THE TICKET! You WON'T WIN THAT ONE! Your defense is this. Almost ALL COPS have that superiority complex of "I know more than you because I know the law!" Most of the time, they really don't because there's TOO MANY TO CLEARLY REMEMBER! Use that against him. When he states you're in violation, ask for the specific penal code and write it down. You can later go online and research the exact language of the code. He might be adding to it; often, they do to get away with an unauthorized ticket! You may also ask to see it IF IT IS A LOCAL STATURE!!!! Generally, they would have that available. I had a cop stop me once on a local stature regarding exhaust where he questioned my stainless exhaust. I asked to see the stature and he was DUMB enough to show it to me. It basically stated that you couldn't run a straight pipe, remove your catalyst or modify the exhaust in any way to produce more noise. I stated that the stainless exhaust had three times the life of a conventional muffler; the issue was reliability as this product was better than a factory install. Based upon this, he had no right to ticket me for installing a better muffler! He left me alone. A cop will use a catch all in a minute ESPECIALLY on an import! Especially if you're making a lot of noise and calling attention to yourself. So, when the odds favor you, stand up to the cop within reason! If your actions justify being stopped by the cop...BE HUMBLE! He will screw you and give a shit less!
Well written...sound advise...GREAT JOB!
the one they use up here is a law that says that a personal vehicle should not draw distracting attention to itself that could be a driving hazard to other motorists... some load of bs like that... i even saw a cop kill a lightshow in a parking lot once because the guy put his car into reverse... if its in gear i guess that means its doing the speed limit... The other thing i have seen the cops use is a dB tester (decibel)... there mostly a load of shit designed to slam dunk guys with straight pipes... which aernt even illegal here.. haha... i can go cattless and straight if i can prove that my fuel economy or reliability is positivley affected... But most cops will throw the book at you if they dont have anything better to do ... like find murderers, drug dealers, rapists and theives... They would rather go catch a couple of guys out for a agressive unlisenced test of acceleration im sure... hell thats what id be doing... but id participate... some of those cop cars are quick... especially the Z06 cop car that they use for organ transplants up here... anyways gl cheers...
The funny thing is I got out of that $232 underglo ticket. So I think my chances are good for getting out of this one. Assuming I get out of this how can I avoid this from happening again? There can't be double jeopardy, right?
Your main problem is that you installed an excessively loud exhaust system on your car, and I am fairly sure you know it is that way because it was your intended purpose. It is really NO different then installing a very large stereo system and jamming with your windows down rolling through the mall parking lot (guilty). Your only advantage would be how the law reads - for example if it gives a certain decibel listed as "excessive." Please be advised though if the office was able to use the excuse he did, chances are the law is loosely written; which means it is the judges discretion. My recommendation, settle with the DA, show him proof that the exhaust was professionally installed, and have the ticket reduced. You will only get this bail out excuse once. Best of luck to you.
Chris...I'd NOT consider this option, you can BEAT the TICKET! Michael is partially correct but more wrong than right. Do not go on the merits of loudness of the muffler, that IS NOT THE ISSUE that will win in court. The fact is cost effectiveness and durability of the exhaust system, You argue that it's stainless steel and will last three times the life of a standard muffler. Further state you plan to never part with the car. That is why you have a LIFETIME alignment package on the car! When you replace the brakes, you plan of getting LIFETIME package. Establish that you are into NOT repetitively spending money on repairs or maintainence. And yes, the cop will state that it's louder; so what? If he is honestly "cracking down" on loud mufflers, his court date should have more exhaust violations than "just" yours. Also, you can ask how many noise violations were written from the same ticket book as yours. You can also ask, how many were imports and how many were Mustangs or Camaros equipped with flowmasters? This information is readily available on his ticket book. Odds are "if" there are others, they'll be imports. You can argue where are the domestics? Do they not have loud mufflers and bigger engines? Bigger engines means bigger noise. He'll have to explain that. THAT IS HOW YOU BEAT A BOGUS TICKET! If I were you and you situation is as you stated it is, SCREW that COP! Fight for your rights; you have nothing to lose and everything to gain. The guy that suggests that your muffler is excessively loud is merely stating his opinion; for all you know, he too could be a cop?
if it's a private lot, they can't nail you for underglow, even if you're crusing through the lots at speed. Unless the owner complains... unless of course your state has some odd law about parking lots...
Oh yeah, this is what this site is meant for, HOW DO YOU BEAT THE SYSTEM OF LAWS THAT ARE THERE TO GUIDE AND PROTECT OUR RIGHTS. If your exhaust is TRUELY LEGAL, then the judge will dismiss it. A problem with Chris's theory is that if they are cracking down on it, you WILL NOT get out of the ticket once before the judge. If you put one of those can mufflers that make your car LOUD, then that is your fault. It is really NO different then the guys that get tickets for loud music. YOU are trying to be cool, in the best way you can to fulfill your definition of cool. The argument between domestic and import is just blatantly retarded. It is irrelevant in the court of law. What Logan is trying to explain is the concept of profiling, and does not apply in your situation, as he did not target you because of race, sex, or religious preference. Before you think of how to beat a ticket on your loud exhaust, IF IT IS LOUD and not just the officers opinion; think about all of those people you are offending when in traffic or driving through a family neighborhood at night waking up those kids that recently went to bed. Laws are created to protect your rights AND the rights of others. Be respectful and you do not have anything to worry about. If you are at fault talk to the DA, they almost always settle to reduce courtroom population.
actually Mr. McGrail, it is profiling. A car's make, in a sense is it's race, it's origin, and therefore one could in fact racially profile an automobile regardless of it's driver. and, incase Logan has any doubt, No, I'm not a cop... But I'm going to be... even if my friends and family think I should be a lawyer...
(There is only one cop car in that picture, and it looks like condos or an apartment complex.) I see why you would say you can beat it, but the fact stands that there are laws about noise pollution and claiming that it's for reduced maintenance isn't going to help the kid if he's driving a econo-box with a 3" fart can on the back of it, simply because most municipalities outlaw rendering it inoperable, if you have one that isn't doing the job it's inoperable. Just like illegal window tints you do it at your risk, the shop can do it for you but saying you had it professionally done doesn't help. It's up to the owner, not the shop, to discern the laws in their area. Obviously noise pollution laws are largely municipal codes and that is the only saving grace here, is that where he got pulled over might not have specific laws on the situation. He needs to do his homework and read search teh municipal codes where he was ticketed. -- I'm sick of this discussion I'll do a little digging--- He may have a chance or he may be screwed we don't know. He hasn't even told us the specifics of his case, but a quick read of lexington's and lexington counties codes it appears he is safe in this instance. B-1 (From table) Under 10,000 pounds (GVWR) 80 db(A) limit, measured no more than 25 feet from the center line of lane is the. B-2 The sound level shall be measured by a sound level meter, Type 1 or Type 2, A-scale weighting network, fast meter response at the specified distance from the centerline of lane of travel, approximately four feet (4') from the ground. B-3 he maximum limit in db(A) applies to any street with a speed of forty-five (45) mph or less, at any time under any condition of grade, load, acceleration or deceleration. Hopefully this reference link will work... http://library5.municode.com/default/template.htm?view=document&doc_action=setHitDoc&doc_hit=1
Thanks for the link man. I will definitely be using that bit of information in court. I went by the administration office today for the zoning maps and they confirm my findings. The area is commercial.
hmm... I did a little more digging and found this in 26-32... It shall be unlawful for any person to willfully make or continue, or cause to be made or continued, any loud, unnecessary and unusual noise which disturbs the peace and quiet of any unincorporated residential area or which causes discomfort or annoyance to any person in any unincorporated residential area of the county. This shall include, but not be limited to, noises made by motor vehicles, motor boats, mechanical devices, electrical devices, electronic devices, human voice, musical instruments, animals and all activities accessory to residential living. In determining whether an occurrence constitutes a violation under this section, a court or other authority should consider, in addition to all other logically relevant factors, one or more of the following: .... (6) In the case of motor vehicles and/or motor boats, whether or not such vehicles are equipped with mufflers and/or such suppression devices which keep exhaust noses down to a level equal to or below that which the manufacturers of such vehicles provided as original equipment designed for acceptable use. (Code 1983, § 11.5-1(b); Ord. No. 98-3, § 2, 5-12-98; Ord. No. 01-3, 8-14-2001) Sorry mate... I'm guessing your exhaust isn't quieter than stock.
I still think you'll beat it. As long as you have documentation to specify that the system is in compliance with state inspection and emissions...it will be tough to convict you. Also, as Adam stated...did the cop make an assumption or use a scientific piece of measuring equipment to make a determination? You should be able to win.
It's going to depend completely on how it was ticketed. If it's as a excessive noise violation he should be good since 80 db is LOUD!!! But that city has some pretty back-assward (and redundant) nuisance laws. The second one I noted was not in a section pertaining to motor vehicles. There was actually another code stating it unlawful to make unnecessary or annoying noise. (It actually states talking loudly as grounds for citation)
Your honour, I believe the officer pulled me over becuase the car I was driving is of Japanese origin. not becuase it was loud... and it goes from there...
Oh..almost forgot. Poorly done CIVIC? The editiors of Sports Compact Car Magazine didn't share your opinion. It was in the December 2002 issue of the magazine. How many of your vehicles appeared in a National Publication?
I'm in Canada and the criminal code up here does not look at how loud your exhaust is as long as it's complete with no leaks... don't matter if you're running 4 inch flowmasters on ceramic headers as long as it's not leaking and you're not excessivly revving your motor after noise by-law of 11 pm. Just a tip my wifes Chevy Tahoe has those 4 inch flow's and ceramic headers and we've been db metered and the cops can't do squat here...
Unfortunately, there are a handfull of maverick cops that hate import hot rods and key on them. Sometimes it's self inflicted; a lot of the time, it's just a cop picking on a kid.That is what got this whole discussion going.
Chris...what you stated makes sense. If you chose to become a Police Officer, you'd more than likely be a FAIR one. There is a difference between a Police Officer and a COP. A Police Officer tempers the law with common sense and sound judgement. They write citations fairly and as needed. Often, the best ticket is the one never written. A COP invents guidelines and stretches the facts to accomplish what THEY want accomplished; justified or not. For a COP, it's all about the badge, uniform and the GUN. I've experienced enough stops under DWB, driving while Black to know the difference. If this offended any REAL Police Officers, it shouldn't. If this DID offend you, you're a COP....GET OVER IT!
Totally true a pig with a hard-on for the young guys with tuners. they don't pick on us here with big exhaust and big tires as long as you have fender flares and your exhaust has no leaks and the pigs here all have hate on's for big trucks with big exhaust it has to be safety inspected after all aftermarket parts are put on...
but as long as it's been inspected the cops here wont touch ya.. Peace..
Love to keep a good argument going... Gotta say that's not true Brent... Also from Canada... and they do pick on the tuners here... Some of them, deservingly so... I can make it through ride checks with holes in my exhaust, and the pipe hanging from my Cat in my car... but some jap scrap tuner mobile rolls through and they pick it apart with a fine tooth comb... same with the trucks...
Does Canada leave these kind of regulations to smaller forms of government, or are they handled on a federal level?
not mine or my wifes never really had a problem with power tripping cops cause they see the inspection sticker and ask when we tell them and they leave us alone..
Logan, Michael... you both claim to be something over the age of 40 correct? (Sorry if I've shot you a little high there Michael, I didn't see you put your age..) I don't think I cock measuring contest it the best way to prove you're both mature adults... both of you have points that have Merit. Yes a loud car will draw a crowd...often the wrong one, and yes there are alot of cops out there who try to over excersise thier authority, both points neither of you can deny. I think this fella has had his thread Jacked enough... time to let it be eh fellas?
laws and regs are generally made on a provincial level here Ontario will have different laws from British columbia and so forth when it's in regards to automobiles. Like the fact that certain types of headlights sold for prarie use are illegal here :( lol
Thanks, I don't know much about Canadia other than Canadans come from up der, so I figured I'd take the chance to learn where the laws come from up there... :-D
it's real easy to beat a ticket up here eh.. Good day you're Honour, Hows it goin' eh? So, I totally can't be guilty of goin' that fast eh... Why not? oh uh... well that's simple eh... My dogsled doesn't have enough horse power eh... cuz you see... it's a dogsled eh... horses don't do so great in the snow... ;)
Chris..you're 100% correct; as you can see, I've tried not to push the thread. Also, I've walked away from it twice. Not me pushing the issue.
I can relate to that...in fact most drivers would unless they're a cop.
um yea my freind "had" a 96 golf with a glasspack and he got pulled over one night and they argud in court and he said it was a performance enhancing exhaust and he got out of the ticket but the funny thing is it was kinda pointless arguing it because like two weeks later a fricken dodge pickup hit himm while my freind was in the turning lane and totaled the golf
lol, I see it having a huge point... Who wants to be paying a ticket on a car they can't drive?!
which province are you in??? As far as ive ever known or read about or been told about or had lawyers/cops/track officals tell me was that as long as your exhaust system works its good to go... im in alberta... cats aernt required, my exhaust leaks like a siv because its old and im waiting till the shush goes away to replace it... dumps are perfectally legal here... you dont even have to muffle your car if you dont feel like it... I know lots of guys that run straight pipes or dump half way back... Actually there is a shop here that does a great setup for mustang side exhaust and it isnt muffled unless you want to pay extra for it haha... there is a cop that lives about 2 blocks away from us that just took delivery of a 2009 california special GT mustang and he had the cats taken off as soon as he got them.... then sold them to some schmuck down in the states at 200 a piece haha... his car is loud and i saw him at the track most of the summer... he drives it home and plays a mean homegame of poker haha... which is illegal but really there are LAWS and there are laws... but i dont really think people should be too loud espeially in residential areas... If ur being loud and cool do it where it matters i suppose... anyways cheers.... ps becomming a cop and being a cop is a thin line the mentality is the same... so what do people think dumps or side exit???
tee hee lol i almost pissed myself reading this but im so not gonna be pestered by logan anymore... its kinda painfull haha... think... if his civic was white with "Ming Tings Takeout" painted in red on the side and top and filled with roman noodles topped with ginger beef.... its just too good a visual eh..... ??? sorry logan serisously have a laugh at yourself... it might feel good...
here here... and yeah im sure that in a court of law you could get out of the ticket if you can show that some kind of scientific evidence has been documented (or dreamed up lol) saying that the efficencey or performance of the car is increaced... better efficency meaning better fuel consumption numbers would be tough to convict even if gas is cheap right now... it wont always be... and the stainless steel is more reliable... but really why aernt all exhaust systems made from stainless seel... im sure most are now... newho merry xmas... or happy hollidays i suppose becuase we cant make the assumption that everyone does Christmas anymore... ... ... has it really come to this???
Stainless Steel = $$$ and Merry Christmas Damnit! Politically correct my foot... Feel free to wish me a happy Kwanza or a good hanukka or happy Chinese newyear when the time comes... I don't care, it will help me be more cuturally diverse! I wouldn't be offended by being wished something merry from another place or way of life...
Alex..yeah, we fenced true enough; but when all was said and done, we ended up with a mutual respect between us. It was all about the cars. It isn't that way with him, his agenda was clear.
i dont really think going after peoples relatives or friends is very respectable... like unless you know the person f off their families... neways... happy christmas...
hell yea but all the same just say and or prove its a performance enhancing exhaust and u will get out of it consider it ur christmas present lol
Tell a JUDGE you've modified the exhaust to make the car....FASTER??? That will CERTAINLY BEAT A TICKET!?!????
I have to agree with Logan on this one! Faster??? That is by far the worst excuse you can use!!!!
it worked for my freind and it doesnt nessacarily have to make it faster it can make it lighter
Ontario... It's illegal NOT to have Cats here... They not do Emissions tests in alberta?
nope they dont test anything... Most people here just dont bother with the cats when they do a exhaust swap... it makes longtube headers a big seller out here because it a easy way to eliminate them... its very popular on mustangs to run dumps out here... the exhaust runs through the headers then some piping then the mufflers thenjust dumps out right after that... it saves the bending issues of going over the rear axle... Gives a real nice crack to the exhaust and is not that outrageous in traffic...
ha, well... Yup, those cars would be pulled here... plus, they'd never pass the emissions tests so they'd never make it to the road anyway lol
Your friend LIED! A JUDGE has heard ALL stories you can possibly come up with. Unless you have a VALID reason that MAKES SENSE, the Judge will politely tell you you're full of CRAP and will spank you more for trying to Bullshit them!
lmao ye but i live in south dakot in a town of less than 2000 ppl so we get away with quite a lot but do u have any suggestions for my engine noises lol
Actually..no, I don't. I do wish you a successful 09 though. With luck, you can get a cooler car than the Grand Am...not a good vehicle for a young man at all!
y do u say the ga is not a good car and happy 09 to u 2
Test drive anything other than a GA of the same year. They are cheap, fit and finish poor and just not a fun or cool car. By driving something comparable of the same year, you'll see just how poor that car really is.
the difference is little cars sound like crap when they are loud, but big trucks sound good loud. as a general rule, higher frequencies are more annoying than low frequencies.
i love it haha... longtube headers bit pipe mufflers and dump haha... it makes the cabin real noisy haha...
really the grand am has never been a great car... kinda a mediocre underbuilt version of the bonneville or grand prix... There not great cars and they have poor powerplants... I would suggest that if you like the 'of' (his spelling) the line grunt drop yourself in a mustang and feel that youl find it a new ball game... whos the chick in the pic ur sister??? nah just screwing with yah haha... pc
i wouldnt call it little cars or big trucks id say smaller displacement with smaller cams sound (my opinion get over it) like crap and bigger displacement engines with bigger cams sound awesome... You could (theorhetically.... probabally not though) drop a 454 in a prius and it would sound good... haha...
prius is the devil. it would squash the poor little thing. hahaha
lol, if you put a 454 in a Prius, it would get to sit in the front seat, and you'd have to sit in the engine bay ;)
lol but all fun asside haha... it would still sound good haha... probabally go like stink if you ever got a driveline in it... haha...
no its not my sister its one of my many female freinds that r in my grade
idk i think theyre pretty tight cars there fast and pretty good drifters by idk ive driven other cars and i lie the ga more
in my grade dammit too young anyways... lol im just fuckin with you stevie...
lol ye i got some in the upper grades and a few in the one below ima p.i.m.p lol
Steven...you've kinda proved my point here. You stated that the Grand Am is a good "DRIFT" car? The last time I checked, the Grand Am was FWD. Drift cars are RWD and have very good power. You're talking Supras, Mustangs, Chargers etc. The Grand Am isn't even close...sorry. Next time, do your homework or you'll be called on it.
lol, it just so happened I was looking at a Prius from my office window today, and I couldn't help but wonder if a 454 would even fit in the passenger compartment of a Prius... I give props to my buddies '82 Accord (I think it's an '82) 4-banger field car... no exhaust what so ever... Carburated... Running it sounds like a Small V8... it actually sounds decent! lol
I went to court and explained my case with the information that I found and what some of you provided for me. Although I feel its not right, in the judges shoes i could understand his decision. He told me in Lexington county you cannot have aftermarket parts on your car that make it any louder than stock, and declared me guilty. He was rather forgiving on the punishment. I had the option of paying $150 or changing the exhaust back to stock and having the arresting officer listen to it and report back to him and he said he would drop it. I have only been pulled by this officer since i moved here so i wouldnt consider myself a nuisance. Anyway im keeping everything until i move back to florida. At least there your not automatically a racer because you own a honda.
Chris...you were in a no win situation. You went before a Judge that was gonna back the cop 100% regardless. The Judge was full of crap. I'd bet the reading of the ordinance was merely a local "catch all" designed to target tuner cars. I'd requested on the spot to read the guideline so I'd not violate it again. The deck was clearly stacked against you and the judge empowered the Cop...which was both their intentions. The cop laughed and told his buddies, "I screwed another tuner today!" Plus, you'd tell your friends, "Hey! I got a ticket for my muffler. I'd not put one on my car if I were you!" Win win for the Cop and the Judge. Yeah, I'd unass that town as soon as I reasonably could.