ok so what do you know?.....
i want to know what you guys know about engines and cars in general. What do you think is the best motor ever built(and that includes reliability lol) and to that guy who likes the buick dont say that garbage 3.8 supercharge motor.
Do you know what a spoon engine is? and dont look it up on wikipedia either.
Whether you like it or not, GM's 3.8 liter V6 is the longest running and most reliable V6 platform. There is a huge fan base whether that of the Grand Nationals which used a turbo-charged version (not supercharged) or that of the Grand Prix which offered a supercharged version. What I find funny, is that you have enough time to look up stuff on Wilki, and ask questions to make yourself feel good. If I am not mistake SPOON is an aftermarket company like Mugen, Stillen, or Shelby.
Are we talking out of the box performance, or ability to be tuned? As for stock NA engines, I think the new BMW S65B40 (E90 M3 engine) is absolutely incredible. A close second would be the GM LS series. As for tunable engines, I'm a little biased because I drive a car with a Toyota 2JZ in it, but I'm also a fan of the Mitsubishi 4G63T. Any engine with which you can quadruple the power without having to replace the internals is a winner in my book. And yes, I purposefully left out supercars and big blocks because efficiency matters =P
I'm more a fan of things that can turn so a Raby built Type 4... Lightweight + low center of gravity + decent power + air cooled=A track monster http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uFRrbjy_pM
wow someone that actually has common sense and knows what they are talking about
WOW THATS GOOD! i dont look stuff up on wiki people have been giving reference links on other posts. and who cars about the grand prix or that motor all the cars they put that in are whales of a cars. do you know what style engine they even produce at spoon?
Technically, Spoon simply produces the aftermarket parts for the engine. The engine block itself is still Honda. The only problem with this thread is that once you start tuning an engine the reliability factor goes down. So your original question was for a well rounded engine. Nce power curve, long lasting reliabilty, proven performance - I will have to stick with the 3.8L V6 from GM. And if you want they are cheap to modify.
as far as relability and modability... i dont know much about imports (but i've heard the 2jz is a great motor) so im gonna give you the domestic rundown (cause thats what immore familiar with... im not some "domestics rock, imports suck" loser who can't respect some great engineering) Chevy small block (i think its the 305.... might be the 350... easiest american motor to mod and nice and torquey) and for a classic... the Ford 302... great motor... huge aftermarket parts selection and plenty of replacement parts available if the need arises (altho Ford builds good motors... esp. the big stuff.)
Classic examples of quality US engineering... the Windsor 302 was still being used into the 90's in the 5.0 Mustang and the current LS series engines are just reinventions of the Chevy 350. If you're going to take that route though, you have to add in the Chevy Fat Rat (especially the L-88, from which the current LS7 is derived) and the Mopar 426 Hemi.
I'd actually really be interested in seeing a tuning competition between the GM V6, the Nissan VQ35DE and the Mitsubishi 4G63T. Forced induction allowed, but have to keep stock internals. All three are pretty bulletproof.
just to let you and others know i just make fun of american cars on here because i like a good debate every once in awhile i do have respect for people that have good platforms and good setups but i dont respect people that half ass there cavalier or have a hideous buick they are trying to mod. Its like taking a volvo wagon and trying to make it fast around corners its just a waist of money,time, and effort.
Volvo wagons are fast. They made them into touring cars you egg. The 'best' engine would probably be a Honda somethingorother because of shit like reliability and strength and blah blah blah, but Ford put the pinto engine in heaps of shit. Like RS2000's and mk1 escorts and shit for rallying. All you needed to do was put a bigger gasket on or a different head or crank and you could change the output/profile of the engine. And if it broke you could fix it with big hammers and wattle and daub. See also Rover K-series VVT and whatever that V6 was they put in a Ford Mondeo/Renault Laguna/Noble M12
what about the 1.9L out of the pre 1990's Escorts with the throttle body injection. i think they made like 63whp. But mine lasted forever. had over 250k miles and still pulled strong ieven beet a couple civics lol.
These rice-racer drag/drift-spec failures don't know what's fast. Civics ftl. My 205 GTi clears it's nose in their general direction. Nobody knows about Mk1 escorts with forest arches and Colin McRae and the Manx Rally
ya even the cosworth escort was a good car when it came out. lol.
The Ford 289 was the hot ticket before the 302. 289 was an extremely reliable engine.
As much as I dislike Fords, Mark is right. You could neglect and abuse the crap out of a 289, and it would not die. Kinda like Ford's 300 ci inline 6.
Cosworth engines rule me
What do you mean a "Spoon engine"? Do you mean an engine tuned and built by Spoon Sports with their parts? They mostly specialise in Hondas.
The GM V6 is very reliable and capable of being tuned with superchargers. To be honest, I would like to see the GM V6 vs the Toyota/Lexus 2GR-FSE and as well as Nissan's VQ35HR.
What, like you? HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
get the amc's on deck
yea those 3.8s are tanks, very durable and strong motors. even the base models are some powerhouses
dont forget about the 351 cleveland,427,428,429,460
ls series engines or the hemi
i say the nissan vq 30 it made the top 10 every year it was in production
which hemi? gen 1, gen 2, or gen 3?
ever since they brought it back its been a great engine
all 3 generations are good, but i prefer gen 2, the big one, the 426.
toyota's 2jz dett. fast, reliable, jus the perfect motor.
Here in europe would say the VW Golf(rabbbit in US i think) Or a Subaru Impreza
we have both vdubs and superus over here in the states
Yeah i know that but seeing as gas is cheaper in the US we have to discount bigger engine cars really and it limits our choices somewhat compared to you lucky guys!
you have a point there, but isnt your roads tiny? just wondering how much is gas at the other side of the pond? its about $2.70 per gallon over here.
I would say either the Mercedes Benz 240d or Td variant of the OM616 introduced in 1973 and was phased out in 1987 and one of these legendary motors in on display in Stuttgart at the Benz museum with over 4.5 million km on it also the legendary 190d Om621 motor introduced in 1958 and phased out in 1991 it was said to be the motor that almost bankrupted Benz because of its low maintenance cost and longevity
and your point is? by the way, dont go to my email on this. do what everybody else does, post.
i was just answering the question of best motors and reliability while they may not be powerhouses like the us v8 they served a purpose by bringing reliable fuel efficient cars to the German public as well as the rest of the world and these cars are now highly sought after by collectors as well as many 3rd world nations because of their reliability under the most diverse circumstances therefore making it one of the worlds best
theres a lot of great us engines that arent v8s. i can name a few like the amc 4.2, iron duke, slant 6, jeep 4.0, ford 1.9,gm 3.8, and even the ford 3.0. some of these are still being used for contractors and forklifts.some of these are still in cars today. the most reliable us v8 is the ford 302. its been around for over 40 years. its in cars, trucks, forklifts, and even air compressers.
tunability would have to be the RB26DETT outa the nissan skyline gtr r-34, and sorry to say man for reliability nothing beats gm's 3.8 v6
i am not that much of a fan of hot rods and muscle, because my area is far away from those types of cars, i am more of an import enthusiast and i drive a 96 civic street tuned...but i would say the deusenberg hotrod j-engine... do they still have these around? history has it that before there were muscle cars, this engine had a huge 8 cylinder profile... pretty much advanced for the 1930's... it's power is great combined with an aluminum chassis...nd didnt the later ones have superchargers with them? i heard they boast almost 400 horses... now that is a great engine...
My personal favorite....... The 2JZ-GTE. I know it's a very typical answer for an Import Tuner fan, but I've loved this engine and the car that made it famous (Toyota Supra) since I was 8 years old. It's the engine that got me into cars and wrenching. I'm also a fan of the supercharged 7.0 V8 in the ZO6. A massive sturdy block with a bad ass supercharger on it (anything supercharged is cool to me. I'm a simple man to please : )
Oh yeah and the 2JZ is going to be the best performance engine as far as reliability goes....
jake....the LS7 7.0L in the Z06 is not supercharged. its N/A. the LS9 6.2L in the ZR-1 is supercharged. both engines are incredible.
Oh damn. I was thinking ZR-1 but just appraised a ZO6 earlier today and had it on the brain. Wow. Thanks for that man lol.
04 BMW M-3 v-8 by far best ratio transmission, and power from a v-8.
reliability... Either the Ford straight 6 that was in the early 90's F- 150's, or the Jeep 4.0 straight 6. Both engines just refuse to quit. performance.... 4g63. 2jz, RB26dett all really good engines.
you cant kill a chevy v-8. too vague of a q...
Wankel engine all day long, close to 300bhp standard from a 1.3, epic tunability and a cool name to boot! What more can you ask for????
The Cadillac V8's are a strong contender for the best motor ever. They were forged with nickel in the iron that resulted in long life. They have gobs of torque starting at 1500 rpms. They were used to motivate the GM motorhomes along with the Eldorado transmission - yes they were front wheel drive. The engines are popular transplants in various four wheel drive projects.
Toyota's 22r. Not the fastest but they just dont die willingly. Lol @ the 3.8, Any early gm aluminum head engine has been a maintenance nightmare. Performance wise they are great, but rather have a v8
I find it funny that you said not to bring up the GM 3.8, seeing as how it's an amazing motor. Had one in my 96 Firebird and put it through hell regularly with no problems. My personal picks? Toyota 4AGE (Mine's a 87 and still running great) GM 3.8